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NESW

Joined:

Apr 08

Posts: 26

NESW says:

Altitude

Hi all,

I know this is a subject that crops up quite frequently but after a search of the site I cannot find the answer I'm looking for, so maybe you guys could help me out?

After reading TRAIL last month both my husband and I would like to climb Mt Toubkal. This of course is something that will be a few years off yet as we are both nowhere near as fit as we would like to be to attempt the climb.

However, we would like to know if there are any smaller mountains we could attempt (anywhere in the world) that could help us to see how we both perform at altitude before embarking on Toubkal? We do not have any winter climbing/rope skills so we are looking for a mountain that can be walked up (grade 1 scrambles in parts would also be ok)

I know that this a mean feat, but I'm hoping to at least find a starting place.

Thanks

“Still round the corner there may wait, A new road or a secret gate.” - Tolkien

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  • Posted 2 years ago (16 February 2009 12:41)
Michael_

Joined:

Oct 08

Posts: 20

Michael_ says:

Re: Altitude

 The Sierra Nevada region of southern spain is a great place to walk with similar terrain to Toubkal.  These are mainland Spains highest mountains with Mulhacen 3474m being the highest.  Staying at one of the higher villages in the Alpujarra (Capileira at 1300m) gives good access to the mountains.  A walk up to the Poqueira Refuge 2500m is a good excursion.  The refuge has a full "hotel" service and a couple of nights there will allow you to tackle some impressive routes and mountains.  Although this is southern Spain, there will be snow patches in June.  Because of the altitude, July and August are not too hot when up high.  I'd go in early July.

[This Reply has been modified by the Author]

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  • Posted 2 years ago (16 February 2009 12:59)
NESW

Joined:

Apr 08

Posts: 26

NESW says:

Re: Altitude

Thanks for the great info Michael, Spain sounds like a great idea. Close to home and not too expensive, will deffinately look into it as it sounds exciting!

Anyone else have any other suggestions??

“Still round the corner there may wait, A new road or a secret gate.” - Tolkien

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  • Posted 2 years ago (16 February 2009 19:46)
orpheus

Joined:

Jul 07

Posts: 946

orpheus says:

Re: Altitude

You don't even need to walk up a mountain to find high altitude, if you're prepared to travel some distance, e.g. Everest Base Camp trek (5600m if going to Kala Pattar or 3800m if stopping at Tengboche monastery), or the Inca Trail in Peru (4200m on Dead Woman's Pass, 3600m at Cusco), or even beautiful Lake Titicaca in Peru/Bolivia (3900m) - all would make great holidays with some walking which would stand you in good stead for your mountain......

Or how about climbing the highest mountain in SE Asia, Mt Kinabalu (4100m) in Borneo?

[This Reply has been modified by the Author]

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  • Posted 2 years ago (17 February 2009 17:45)
drg andy

Joined:

Jan 08

Posts: 718

drg andy says:

Re: Altitude

I am a slow acclimitiser and usually take over a week to feel strong again but had no problem on Toubkal last Feb. Walk slow is a good rule to follow. The walk from Imlil to the Neltner refuge is tougher than you might think (about 1600m ascent) but a steady plod and a mule for your sack is a good plan. Then a day in and around the hut area (maybe a plod out of the hut into the combe is good) before an early (7-8am) start and a slow, steady pace will see the summit in 5 hours or so. 3-4 in descent. Enjoy!

Explore the Vanoise - its soooo much better than Chamonix!

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  • Posted 2 years ago (01 March 2009 15:43)
drg andy

Joined:

Jan 08

Posts: 718

drg andy says:

Re: Altitude

PS my little pic (avatar?) is on Toubkal)

Explore the Vanoise - its soooo much better than Chamonix!

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  • Posted 2 years ago (01 March 2009 15:44)
crashlad

Joined:

Dec 08

Posts: 33

crashlad says:

Re: Altitude

If you go to Chamonix you will be able to travel up the "Aguille de Midi" via Cable Car (38Euro return) this gives you access on to the "Mare de Glass" which is a good place to practice winter skills in relative safety at altitude in an area of outstanding beauty. With the town of Chamonix itself being at around the same hight as Ben Nevis (995m) & the Aguille de Midi being a long way above (3842m or 12,605ft) you can definatly gage your response to altitude.

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  • Posted 2 years ago (04 March 2009 13:05)
wurz

Joined:

May 07

Posts: 1910

wurz says:

Re: Altitude

crashlad said:

If you go to Chamonix you will be able to travel up the "Aguille de Midi" via Cable Car (38Euro return) this gives you access on to the "Mare de Glass" which is a good place to practice winter skills in relative safety at altitude in an area of outstanding beauty. With the town of Chamonix itself being at around the same hight as Ben Nevis (995m) & the Aguille de Midi being a long way above (3842m or 12,605ft) you can definatly gage your response to altitude.

------ End Quote ------

I'm not sure walking out the back of the AdM down onto the plan is the best place for someone who has never been to the Alps before to start.  I also think that going straight from the valley up in the car with no aclimatisation previously will probably make most people feel pretty unwell.

I don't want to be the Worlds best climber, just the oldest.

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  • Posted 2 years ago (04 March 2009 14:56)
drg andy

Joined:

Jan 08

Posts: 718

drg andy says:

Re: Altitude

crashlad says:

Re: Altitude

If you go to Chamonix you will be able to travel up the "Aguille de Midi" via Cable Car (38Euro return) this gives you access on to the "Mare de Glass" which is a good place to practice winter skills in relative safety at altitude in an area of outstanding beauty. With the town of Chamonix itself being at around the same hight as Ben Nevis (995m) & the Aguille de Midi being a long way above (3842m or 12,605ft) you can definatly gage your response to altitude.
 

 

I think you mean the Envers train/ladders. The AdeM takes you to a VERY narrow ridge to the Vallee Blanche NOT Mer de Glace. To access the MdeG from Envers you need to descend about 150-200m of steep ladders (rarely does anyone rope up either!)

Having a coffee at A de M and chilling out there for a couple of hours would definitely give you a feeling for altitude but it is cold and you would probably do better to go up to Brevent on the other side and follw the Tour de MB variation to Plan Praz. Walking around the 2500m contour and actually getting some exercise without needing crampons etc (fab views too!) This is also far cheaper!! About 14 euros for a return.

 

Explore the Vanoise - its soooo much better than Chamonix!

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  • Posted 2 years ago (08 March 2009 14:23)
JeremyAshcroft

Joined:

Jan 07

Posts: 297

JeremyAshcroft says:

Re: Altitude

 The most telling increments if you are new to altitude seem to be around the 2500m and 3500m mark, so I would look for walks that would take these contours in. As already suggested areas like the Sierra Nevada and Chamonix are good, but you could also consider other parts of the Alps like the Sasstal, Arola, Stubia Alps and the Dolomites.You could also consider the Pyrenees. Hut to Hut walks and long distance routes are a good options - completing them you will cross high passes and experience sleeping high. If you want to try more exposed terrain via ferrata offers none climbers the opportunity to get on to steep, vertical and even overhanging rock.

Having said all that Toubkal is the perfect peak to experience high altitude for the first time. It is a fairly soft-touch mountain and if you a have a week or more in the area (particularly around Imlil) there are plenty of high pass walks for acclimatization. I have hosted trips to Toubkal and for a number of people it was there first time up high and with a careful build up they found it enjoyable and relatively easy. If you are hill fit for British hills you should have no problem, just make sure you give yourself enough time to acclimatize. 

Mountaineering editor, Trail

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  • Posted 2 years ago (08 March 2009 16:40)
munrobugger

Joined:

Dec 08

Posts: 44

munrobugger says:

Re: Altitude

crashlad said:

If you go to Chamonix you will be able to travel up the "Aguille de Midi" via Cable Car (38Euro return) this gives you access on to the "Mare de Glass" which is a good place to practice winter skills in relative safety at altitude in an area of outstanding beauty. With the town of Chamonix itself being at around the same hight as Ben Nevis (995m) & the Aguille de Midi being a long way above (3842m or 12,605ft) you can definatly gage your response to altitude.

------ End Quote ------haveto agree with wurz going up the midi at Chamonix and down onto the mara de glass is not a good idea and certainly doe not help in altitude for beginers.In fact i think that is a silly idea.  I did Toubkal a few years ago and did it over 7/8 days I found getting to the summitt was no problem and felt i was on top of a mountain in Scotland. But altitude does effect different people. My advise would be if you can afford it is to go to Everest Base Camp and get some experience in walking at altitude Walk slow and drink plenty of water.

 

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  • Posted 2 years ago (01 April 2009 11:54)
Andy Say

Joined:

Mar 08

Posts: 2084

Andy Say says:

Re: Altitude

There's some very good advice contained in the free Medex booklet on travel at high altitude.  You can get it from here ( http://medex.org.uk//medex_book/english_version.php ) as a download or if you pm me I could post you out a paper version.

Yours,

Breathless,

Andy

Mountain Leader Training - you know we talk sense :-)

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  • Posted 2 years ago (01 April 2009 15:40)

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